Rolling Sixes... again.
Muirsical Conversation With Robert Berry
Muirsical Conversation With Robert Berry
In review of the self-titled debut album from SiX BY SiX, featuring the talents of singer & multi-instrumentalist Robert Berry (3, 3.2, Hush, Alliance, Greg Kihn Band, solo), SAGA guitarist Ian Crichton and Saxon drummer Nigel Glockler, FabricationsHQ commented that it was "an exceptional album by an extremely talented and clearly simpatico trio... a creative blend of contemporary hard rock and prog."
Additionally, such was the musical bond between the three musicians (unified in both musical creativity and friendship) there was little chance of calling it a debut album day (underlined by the fact this is a three album deal, minimum).
Reconvening in 2023 at Robert Berry’s Soundtek studio in the Bay Area of California to have at it once again, the band delivered sophomore release Beyond Shadowland earlier this year; the album takes its lead from the debut but rocks a heavier edge as well as stretching the sonic shapes and subtleties of its predecessor.
Robert Berry, a regular visitor to FabricationsHQ, took time out from studio work and rehearsing SiX BY SiX songs for future live performances, to talk in detail about the album, as well as the working relationship & songwriting processes with Ian Crichton and Nigel Glockler.
But the conversation started by going back to the early gestation period of what became Beyond Shadowland…
Additionally, such was the musical bond between the three musicians (unified in both musical creativity and friendship) there was little chance of calling it a debut album day (underlined by the fact this is a three album deal, minimum).
Reconvening in 2023 at Robert Berry’s Soundtek studio in the Bay Area of California to have at it once again, the band delivered sophomore release Beyond Shadowland earlier this year; the album takes its lead from the debut but rocks a heavier edge as well as stretching the sonic shapes and subtleties of its predecessor.
Robert Berry, a regular visitor to FabricationsHQ, took time out from studio work and rehearsing SiX BY SiX songs for future live performances, to talk in detail about the album, as well as the working relationship & songwriting processes with Ian Crichton and Nigel Glockler.
But the conversation started by going back to the early gestation period of what became Beyond Shadowland…
Ross Muir: In the spring of last year, while just shooting the catch-up breeze, I recall you mentioning you had felt a little pressure and worry as regards following up the SiX BY SiX debut album.
But, after getting the nuts and bolts of a first song down with Ian and Nigel, you knew you were going to be OK.
Robert Berry: That’s right, but that was after about three months of back and forth with Ian and Nigel; the song was Spectre, which is one of our favourites on the album.
How it all works, usually, is Ian will send me these little genius guitar parts; little nuggets that make me go "Oh my God, what am I going to do with that!"
From there, I’ll glue a song together; I’m the lyric and chorus writer so I put something together, sent it to him and said "I think we have a start here. He replied "yes, but it isn’t as good as the first album" [laughs].
But I said "Ian, I’m throwing the ball back to you – catch it, massage it a little, and throw it back to me!"
And he did, he thew it back to me with a few more ideas and that’s how the demo of that song developed.
It went back and forth between us a couple of times but by that point we knew the magic was there.
And that’s how we work; these songs don’t just pop out like Paul McCartney with, say, Blackbird; this is about trying to make the most of the best parts that the three of us come up with.
I guess what I’m saying is we do it organically; we don’t manufacture anything. Ian does what he wants to do, I then do what I want to do with it, and Nigel lays down the drums the way he wants to play them.
Through that process it becomes whatever it is SiX BY SiX is, without ever forcing it, or contriving it.
RM: Spectre is one of the songs I wanted to make sure we discussed or mentioned, because it encapsulates the SiX BY SiX sound. Staccato groove, those trademark angular lines from Ian, a number of tempo and rhythmic shifts – Spectre goes off at a tangent a couple of times yet always returns to a melodic focus.
It also helps prove your songwriting point; this could only be an organic process; you are not putting a song like Spectre together over one writing session…
RB: And, again, it’s not a struggle, it’s a process. There’s a big difference there.
We’re not saying "oh, this doesn’t work!" We’re throwing it back and forth; if I give Ian a part and he says "this isn’t doing anything for me" I’ll say "OK, what’s your idea for it?"
It’s a constant give and take, but in the end I’m really proud of this album. We always set out to make the album heavier than the first album and to not make the same album twice. That was the goal and we achieved that goal.
But, after getting the nuts and bolts of a first song down with Ian and Nigel, you knew you were going to be OK.
Robert Berry: That’s right, but that was after about three months of back and forth with Ian and Nigel; the song was Spectre, which is one of our favourites on the album.
How it all works, usually, is Ian will send me these little genius guitar parts; little nuggets that make me go "Oh my God, what am I going to do with that!"
From there, I’ll glue a song together; I’m the lyric and chorus writer so I put something together, sent it to him and said "I think we have a start here. He replied "yes, but it isn’t as good as the first album" [laughs].
But I said "Ian, I’m throwing the ball back to you – catch it, massage it a little, and throw it back to me!"
And he did, he thew it back to me with a few more ideas and that’s how the demo of that song developed.
It went back and forth between us a couple of times but by that point we knew the magic was there.
And that’s how we work; these songs don’t just pop out like Paul McCartney with, say, Blackbird; this is about trying to make the most of the best parts that the three of us come up with.
I guess what I’m saying is we do it organically; we don’t manufacture anything. Ian does what he wants to do, I then do what I want to do with it, and Nigel lays down the drums the way he wants to play them.
Through that process it becomes whatever it is SiX BY SiX is, without ever forcing it, or contriving it.
RM: Spectre is one of the songs I wanted to make sure we discussed or mentioned, because it encapsulates the SiX BY SiX sound. Staccato groove, those trademark angular lines from Ian, a number of tempo and rhythmic shifts – Spectre goes off at a tangent a couple of times yet always returns to a melodic focus.
It also helps prove your songwriting point; this could only be an organic process; you are not putting a song like Spectre together over one writing session…
RB: And, again, it’s not a struggle, it’s a process. There’s a big difference there.
We’re not saying "oh, this doesn’t work!" We’re throwing it back and forth; if I give Ian a part and he says "this isn’t doing anything for me" I’ll say "OK, what’s your idea for it?"
It’s a constant give and take, but in the end I’m really proud of this album. We always set out to make the album heavier than the first album and to not make the same album twice. That was the goal and we achieved that goal.
Now, while we’re talking about Beyond Shadowland, I’m already starting to think about album three!
Ian is sending me some ideas and even Nigel, who has been very busy with Saxon lately, has lots of ideas and is sending me some things.
So, it’s the same process but this time around it’s even scarier because having done heavier with Beyond Shadowland, with the drums more pounding, that sort of thing, where would I like to take it next?
But that’s also part of the process – how do we expand it a little, but still give the fanbase something that is SiX BY SiX? I don’t know yet, is the answer!
And I probably won’t be sure until it all develops a little more and we have gone another step or two in whatever the direction of the third album will be – without making it rap, or screamo! [laughs].
RM: Joking aside, that has to be both challenging and exciting for you as a singer, musician and a songwriter. You have this block of SiX BY SiX clay that you are moulding, but even you don’t know what shape it will take.
RB: Yes. And what helps is the fact that Ian comes up with so many great ideas on guitar, where I go "Huh? How’d he even do that!" [laughs].
RM: Also, on this album, some of Nigel’s rhythmic patterns are as creative as Ian’s guitar parts – indeed, some of his drum parts and percussive work are highlights of the album.
RB: Nigel really did step up in a couple of places on this one; he had some almost Steve Gadd-ish type stuff, and beats you would hear in a band like Toto, but in harder rock style.
We didn’t intentionally model it that way, but when he was coming up with some of this stuff I would say "Damn, Nigel, that’s great! Where did you come up with that?" Because I always thought of Nigel as something like John Bonham, had he been playing in YES, you know?
But, no, it’s more of a jazz background, and guys like Steve Gadd. And that shows when he can take a chance and let go, which he can with our music.
In fact, one of my favourites on the album, although nobody else mentions it, or seems to like it [laughs] is Titans, which started with Nigel.
RM: Well, I'm your exception to the musical rule, because l really like that song.
Now, that said, first time around Titans absolutely threw me. The marching "oom pop-pop!" chant, for exmple, immediately has you thinking "where the hell are they going with this?"
But it’s such a weirdly structured song – synth rhythms counterpointing with what Nigel is doing, eastern motifs, a little bit of what is best described as alt-rock Zeppelin – that it becomes utterly compelling.
Kudos to you all for one, coming up with it, two, taking those sort of risks and three, putting it on the album.
It's not every band that would push play on a song like that.
RB: Thank you. As I said, it really all started with Nigel. He sent me what was pretty much just the verse groove, with his drums and that keyboard thing going on.
I thought "well, I kinda like the really straight pounding of the drums, and he also has that Hindu sort of thing going on in the background."
I knew Ian wouldn’t like it though, because it was just too straight; almost like a rhythmic groove on a loop. But I sent two measures of the piece over to Ian and said "I’m working on something; could you put something heavier down on guitar over it because I’ve got this idea."
But I didn’t tell him that I had a song going by this time, and lyrics, and the oom pop-pop [laughs].
Ian sent me something back almost right away, which I thought was perfect, but I didn’t have a link to the little chorus part I was now working on.
So I get back to Ian, sent him my section and said "how do you put those two parts together?" Again, he sends me something right back saying "well, how’s that?"
So now I can send him the verse, the link and the chorus, and I did – and he flipped!
He said "This is great!" I replied "Yeah, I know, and it all started with Nigel." He went "What?!" [laughter]
I said, "yep; this was an interesting co-write where I had to trick you to get your genius parts to fit into Nigel’s parts; now we can move forward and put the whole song together!"
RM: Great stuff. As you said earlier, it really is all about the back and forth.
I must ask, though, where did the oom pop-pop chant come from?
RB: I was in bed after working on the song all day, and this "oom pop-pop k’chang chang" chant pops into my head! I thought "well, that’s really weird" [laughs]; but I got my phone out and sang into it so I could listen back to it, and think about it, the next day.
It’s still kind of strange, for me, because that’s not something I would usually do, but as hard as it might be to perform live, damn if I couldn’t hear an audience singing along to that!
Yes, it's odd, but I'm glad we got there; it’s a really interesting song.
RM: You mentioned the album being heavier than the debut, but there’s also an angrier, edgier element at play. The Arms of a Word is a great example, where you decry the division created by modern media, fake news and click bait.
Ian is sending me some ideas and even Nigel, who has been very busy with Saxon lately, has lots of ideas and is sending me some things.
So, it’s the same process but this time around it’s even scarier because having done heavier with Beyond Shadowland, with the drums more pounding, that sort of thing, where would I like to take it next?
But that’s also part of the process – how do we expand it a little, but still give the fanbase something that is SiX BY SiX? I don’t know yet, is the answer!
And I probably won’t be sure until it all develops a little more and we have gone another step or two in whatever the direction of the third album will be – without making it rap, or screamo! [laughs].
RM: Joking aside, that has to be both challenging and exciting for you as a singer, musician and a songwriter. You have this block of SiX BY SiX clay that you are moulding, but even you don’t know what shape it will take.
RB: Yes. And what helps is the fact that Ian comes up with so many great ideas on guitar, where I go "Huh? How’d he even do that!" [laughs].
RM: Also, on this album, some of Nigel’s rhythmic patterns are as creative as Ian’s guitar parts – indeed, some of his drum parts and percussive work are highlights of the album.
RB: Nigel really did step up in a couple of places on this one; he had some almost Steve Gadd-ish type stuff, and beats you would hear in a band like Toto, but in harder rock style.
We didn’t intentionally model it that way, but when he was coming up with some of this stuff I would say "Damn, Nigel, that’s great! Where did you come up with that?" Because I always thought of Nigel as something like John Bonham, had he been playing in YES, you know?
But, no, it’s more of a jazz background, and guys like Steve Gadd. And that shows when he can take a chance and let go, which he can with our music.
In fact, one of my favourites on the album, although nobody else mentions it, or seems to like it [laughs] is Titans, which started with Nigel.
RM: Well, I'm your exception to the musical rule, because l really like that song.
Now, that said, first time around Titans absolutely threw me. The marching "oom pop-pop!" chant, for exmple, immediately has you thinking "where the hell are they going with this?"
But it’s such a weirdly structured song – synth rhythms counterpointing with what Nigel is doing, eastern motifs, a little bit of what is best described as alt-rock Zeppelin – that it becomes utterly compelling.
Kudos to you all for one, coming up with it, two, taking those sort of risks and three, putting it on the album.
It's not every band that would push play on a song like that.
RB: Thank you. As I said, it really all started with Nigel. He sent me what was pretty much just the verse groove, with his drums and that keyboard thing going on.
I thought "well, I kinda like the really straight pounding of the drums, and he also has that Hindu sort of thing going on in the background."
I knew Ian wouldn’t like it though, because it was just too straight; almost like a rhythmic groove on a loop. But I sent two measures of the piece over to Ian and said "I’m working on something; could you put something heavier down on guitar over it because I’ve got this idea."
But I didn’t tell him that I had a song going by this time, and lyrics, and the oom pop-pop [laughs].
Ian sent me something back almost right away, which I thought was perfect, but I didn’t have a link to the little chorus part I was now working on.
So I get back to Ian, sent him my section and said "how do you put those two parts together?" Again, he sends me something right back saying "well, how’s that?"
So now I can send him the verse, the link and the chorus, and I did – and he flipped!
He said "This is great!" I replied "Yeah, I know, and it all started with Nigel." He went "What?!" [laughter]
I said, "yep; this was an interesting co-write where I had to trick you to get your genius parts to fit into Nigel’s parts; now we can move forward and put the whole song together!"
RM: Great stuff. As you said earlier, it really is all about the back and forth.
I must ask, though, where did the oom pop-pop chant come from?
RB: I was in bed after working on the song all day, and this "oom pop-pop k’chang chang" chant pops into my head! I thought "well, that’s really weird" [laughs]; but I got my phone out and sang into it so I could listen back to it, and think about it, the next day.
It’s still kind of strange, for me, because that’s not something I would usually do, but as hard as it might be to perform live, damn if I couldn’t hear an audience singing along to that!
Yes, it's odd, but I'm glad we got there; it’s a really interesting song.
RM: You mentioned the album being heavier than the debut, but there’s also an angrier, edgier element at play. The Arms of a Word is a great example, where you decry the division created by modern media, fake news and click bait.
RM: Outside of The Arms of a Word, and a couple of others, there’s a discernible, albeit loose, lyrical theme of cause and effect, although I hear it more as a narrative about being positive about the future whilst acknowledging, but never going back to, the past.
The question then is are your lyrics also an organic process, or pre-meditated, or some other approach?
RB: And the answer is I don’t know! [laughs] I really don’t.
I will say this though; I’m a really positive person, which I get from my mom. If anything was bothering her, she would say "well, it will look different tomorrow" or "I can sleep on it." That was her thing.
Even in The Arms of a Word, there is so much negativity, but I always try and look for the positive, because you and I both know you can’t convince anybody once they have their feet firmly planted in what they think, or believe, whether that be politics or any other subject.
The words they choose to use are always from their corner of the ring, you know?
I don’t believe it used to be that way; even if we still felt the same, we could talk about whatever the subject was with each other and have respect for each other’s opinions; but now the words are so divisive.
So, again, I try to put a positive spin on all of that because I am such a positive person.
But to go back to your original question, Ross, I honestly don’t know where the lyrics come from; they just come out.
Different things affect me every day and I just try and stay positive, and write positively, about those things.
In fact just the other day I had a blues singer here at Soundtek – as you know I produce a lot of people at my studio, but while I’ve produced a lot of blues tracks for clients, this is the first time I’ve produced a full blues album, which is kinda cool.
Now, what’s interesting, is blues musicians tend to be more laid back and do a lot of jamming, that sort of stuff, whereas I’m more nose to the grindstone.
So, we start cutting a blues track for the album and we’ve still to get lyrics for the second verse; I said "look, I’ll work on the rhythm track and you sit over there on the couch and work on the lyrics for the second verse."
At the end of that day, she turned to me and said "I feel like I’ve just had a child" [laughs]; "I’ve just birthed this baby and it has better words than I had before!"
I said "that’s because your lyrics are based on who you are, and who you are, today."
And that’s sorta me, too. Every day is different. A few days ago, we were cutting a blues track; today I’m talking to you; tomorrow it’ll be something else.
But it’s about taking all the positives from those experiences, whether yours or mine, and all of a sudden, tomorrow, we’ve got a song.
RM: So that’s the positive impetus for the lyrics, but you still have to write them and shape them.
RB: It is hard with the lyrics, yes, but, as you mentioned about past and future, I don’t think about the past.
I think about what I can do tomorrow and hope I can make a difference within the circle I can reach.
I can’t make a difference in the world, but I always try and give more than I get; that’s a big thing for me.
When I think back to my previous albums, I realise that, unless a song has been on a weird subject, they’ve all been pretty positive, but I haven’t repeated myself yet.
And there’s another worry about this third album, to not repeat ourselves! OK, we’ve done The Arms of the Word, let’s do The Arms of the Feet! [loud laughter].
The question then is are your lyrics also an organic process, or pre-meditated, or some other approach?
RB: And the answer is I don’t know! [laughs] I really don’t.
I will say this though; I’m a really positive person, which I get from my mom. If anything was bothering her, she would say "well, it will look different tomorrow" or "I can sleep on it." That was her thing.
Even in The Arms of a Word, there is so much negativity, but I always try and look for the positive, because you and I both know you can’t convince anybody once they have their feet firmly planted in what they think, or believe, whether that be politics or any other subject.
The words they choose to use are always from their corner of the ring, you know?
I don’t believe it used to be that way; even if we still felt the same, we could talk about whatever the subject was with each other and have respect for each other’s opinions; but now the words are so divisive.
So, again, I try to put a positive spin on all of that because I am such a positive person.
But to go back to your original question, Ross, I honestly don’t know where the lyrics come from; they just come out.
Different things affect me every day and I just try and stay positive, and write positively, about those things.
In fact just the other day I had a blues singer here at Soundtek – as you know I produce a lot of people at my studio, but while I’ve produced a lot of blues tracks for clients, this is the first time I’ve produced a full blues album, which is kinda cool.
Now, what’s interesting, is blues musicians tend to be more laid back and do a lot of jamming, that sort of stuff, whereas I’m more nose to the grindstone.
So, we start cutting a blues track for the album and we’ve still to get lyrics for the second verse; I said "look, I’ll work on the rhythm track and you sit over there on the couch and work on the lyrics for the second verse."
At the end of that day, she turned to me and said "I feel like I’ve just had a child" [laughs]; "I’ve just birthed this baby and it has better words than I had before!"
I said "that’s because your lyrics are based on who you are, and who you are, today."
And that’s sorta me, too. Every day is different. A few days ago, we were cutting a blues track; today I’m talking to you; tomorrow it’ll be something else.
But it’s about taking all the positives from those experiences, whether yours or mine, and all of a sudden, tomorrow, we’ve got a song.
RM: So that’s the positive impetus for the lyrics, but you still have to write them and shape them.
RB: It is hard with the lyrics, yes, but, as you mentioned about past and future, I don’t think about the past.
I think about what I can do tomorrow and hope I can make a difference within the circle I can reach.
I can’t make a difference in the world, but I always try and give more than I get; that’s a big thing for me.
When I think back to my previous albums, I realise that, unless a song has been on a weird subject, they’ve all been pretty positive, but I haven’t repeated myself yet.
And there’s another worry about this third album, to not repeat ourselves! OK, we’ve done The Arms of the Word, let’s do The Arms of the Feet! [loud laughter].
Ian Crichton, Nigel Glockler, Robert Berry; collectively and creatively, SiX BY SiX.
RM: Providing contrast to the weight and general heaviness of the album is Only You Can Decide.
That’s a lovely little number that works as a downtempo, mid-album interlude – was that always the intention?
RB: No, not at all. The album was actually complete, but Ian, Nigel and I were on a conference call and I said "I feel like we have done so much work on this album that I’d like the listener to have a break from the heaviness."
Now, it was actually back during the first album that Ian sent me the acoustic guitar part that is the verse of this song. Back then I said "this just won’t work for us; it’s too Dust in the Wind by Kansas," songs like that.
But, with album two, I just felt like we needed something like that plain cracker you take at wine tasting – you take a sip of wine, then you take a bite of the cracker, to cleanse the palate.
Ian and Nigel both agreed, so I went to my hard drive where I keep everything we have ever done, including all the little pieces and ideas, and I’m looking at this one piece from Ian where I had put a red dot beside the file name. I opened it up and I thought "wow, this could work."
Also, I had a friend who had a health issue he needed to take care of, and that entered that day’s thinking – only you can decide; you need to do this for yourself.
So I put something together, sent it to Ian and he calls me right back saying "this is great; I need to put a little solo on this!"
It all came together that easily, right at the end of everything we had already done.
RM: Well, I for one I’m glad it found a place on Beyond Shadowland because it acts as a lovely, contemplative interlude to the heavier weight and energy of the rest of the album.
RB: People are going to be thinking this is a case of the cheque’s in the mail [laughs], because you’re saying everything I like to hear about these songs; but I know you are always honest with your comments, so thank you.
Basically, you’ve connected with why I thought we should do certain things this time around; like making it heavier, doing a song like Titans, dropping in Only You Can Decide, all the rest of it.
I honestly believe that we have taken a positive step beyond the first album and have, this time, not just one song but two or three songs that should become bigger than anything on the debut.
They are definitely heavier, so they should connect with a bigger rock audience. At least that’s the hope!
RM: Well, to continue the honest commentary and play Devil’s Advocate, we are in an age where many a rock fan wants their music from a successful, tried and tested, classic rock formula; hence why I believe you will still have more success with progressive rock fans at this stage, who are more open to what bands such as SiX BY SiX are doing.
Gain a strong foothold there, then, hopefully, you'll start to attract the attention of the wider and bigger rock audience, much like Rush did.
In fact I can sum it up with how I signed off the album review – "Beyond Shadowland isn’t as immediately accessible as the debut, but if you take a deeper dive, the listener is truly rewarded."
RB: I really appreciate you saying all that; it’s also interesting you mention Rush because I’ve recently been learning all the SiX BY SiX material here in my studio, where I have my keyboards all set up.
And that's because if and when we perform – we were going to be playing ProgStock in October until Ian unfortunately broke his leg – I will have to do The Geddy Lee, as I call it! [laughs].
I play bass and sing, but on the choruses, particularly the material from the first album, I would have to switch to left-hand bass and right-hand keyboards, while still singing.
Now, on the second album, there are less keyboards and more guitar, which I think is a good thing; but the songs on that first album are really hard for me to do, with all the keyboards.
ProgStock would have been good for us but, as mentioned, Ian can't perform, so we have had to cancel everything we had planned for this year; Saga have also had to cancel their upcoming committements.
And even though it’s a guitar world, you might be right about having the progressive fans more than the rock fans, at this point – and we do have a more progressive label.
I always try to analyse it, but it’s like your question about where do the lyrics come from and me saying I dunno! [laughs]
I’d rather be oblivious to it, do what I do and hope people like what each of us, Ian, Nigel and myself, are creating together, organically. We is what we is!
RM: Indeed. You are a rock band, at the core, but one that can’t really be pigeonholed, as Titans proves.
Yet you also have highly accessible, progressively arranged heavy melodic-rock songs like The Mission, which closes out the album…
That’s a lovely little number that works as a downtempo, mid-album interlude – was that always the intention?
RB: No, not at all. The album was actually complete, but Ian, Nigel and I were on a conference call and I said "I feel like we have done so much work on this album that I’d like the listener to have a break from the heaviness."
Now, it was actually back during the first album that Ian sent me the acoustic guitar part that is the verse of this song. Back then I said "this just won’t work for us; it’s too Dust in the Wind by Kansas," songs like that.
But, with album two, I just felt like we needed something like that plain cracker you take at wine tasting – you take a sip of wine, then you take a bite of the cracker, to cleanse the palate.
Ian and Nigel both agreed, so I went to my hard drive where I keep everything we have ever done, including all the little pieces and ideas, and I’m looking at this one piece from Ian where I had put a red dot beside the file name. I opened it up and I thought "wow, this could work."
Also, I had a friend who had a health issue he needed to take care of, and that entered that day’s thinking – only you can decide; you need to do this for yourself.
So I put something together, sent it to Ian and he calls me right back saying "this is great; I need to put a little solo on this!"
It all came together that easily, right at the end of everything we had already done.
RM: Well, I for one I’m glad it found a place on Beyond Shadowland because it acts as a lovely, contemplative interlude to the heavier weight and energy of the rest of the album.
RB: People are going to be thinking this is a case of the cheque’s in the mail [laughs], because you’re saying everything I like to hear about these songs; but I know you are always honest with your comments, so thank you.
Basically, you’ve connected with why I thought we should do certain things this time around; like making it heavier, doing a song like Titans, dropping in Only You Can Decide, all the rest of it.
I honestly believe that we have taken a positive step beyond the first album and have, this time, not just one song but two or three songs that should become bigger than anything on the debut.
They are definitely heavier, so they should connect with a bigger rock audience. At least that’s the hope!
RM: Well, to continue the honest commentary and play Devil’s Advocate, we are in an age where many a rock fan wants their music from a successful, tried and tested, classic rock formula; hence why I believe you will still have more success with progressive rock fans at this stage, who are more open to what bands such as SiX BY SiX are doing.
Gain a strong foothold there, then, hopefully, you'll start to attract the attention of the wider and bigger rock audience, much like Rush did.
In fact I can sum it up with how I signed off the album review – "Beyond Shadowland isn’t as immediately accessible as the debut, but if you take a deeper dive, the listener is truly rewarded."
RB: I really appreciate you saying all that; it’s also interesting you mention Rush because I’ve recently been learning all the SiX BY SiX material here in my studio, where I have my keyboards all set up.
And that's because if and when we perform – we were going to be playing ProgStock in October until Ian unfortunately broke his leg – I will have to do The Geddy Lee, as I call it! [laughs].
I play bass and sing, but on the choruses, particularly the material from the first album, I would have to switch to left-hand bass and right-hand keyboards, while still singing.
Now, on the second album, there are less keyboards and more guitar, which I think is a good thing; but the songs on that first album are really hard for me to do, with all the keyboards.
ProgStock would have been good for us but, as mentioned, Ian can't perform, so we have had to cancel everything we had planned for this year; Saga have also had to cancel their upcoming committements.
And even though it’s a guitar world, you might be right about having the progressive fans more than the rock fans, at this point – and we do have a more progressive label.
I always try to analyse it, but it’s like your question about where do the lyrics come from and me saying I dunno! [laughs]
I’d rather be oblivious to it, do what I do and hope people like what each of us, Ian, Nigel and myself, are creating together, organically. We is what we is!
RM: Indeed. You are a rock band, at the core, but one that can’t really be pigeonholed, as Titans proves.
Yet you also have highly accessible, progressively arranged heavy melodic-rock songs like The Mission, which closes out the album…
RM: You mentioned rehearsing your parts for potential, future live dates. Beyond the unfortunate cancellation of your appearance at ProgStock, performing live, or even touring, is clearly an aim.
RB: That’s the only way to truly move forward; having the band play live, and get to that wider audience.
We also had a few European dates lined up but they had to be cancelled for a whole number of reasons.
It's tough at the moment; I would love to call you up and say "Hey, Ross, can you book us a few hotels and get us a backline?" But right now, circumstances being what they are, coming over is impossible.
It seems right when the plane is about to lift off from the runway, the flight tower grounds the flight!
RM: Indeed. But, to follow your philosophy of positivity, having even more material to play via the forthcoming third album, along with associated ongoing promotion and word of mouth, will all, hopefully, make performing live, or touring, a distinct possibility.
RB: Well, we are focussed on looking to see where we want to go with the third album, because you're right, we’ll also need more material to play if we are going out on the road.
As I mentioned, we have already started exchanging ideas for album three; once we get the meat of a few songs from those ideas, along with some lyrics, and maybe a strong intro or two, that will get us going on the project and really kick it off.
But, it’s exactly like you said about this band, we are a little bit hard to access immediately.
For me, though, that’s a good thing, artistically. And, if we had done a whole bunch of songs that sounded like Save The Night from the first album, a lot of people would have just said "Oh that’s just heavy AOR with a big chorus at the end," or some other negative comment [laughs].
But that’s the point, the chorus did come in at the end, so it was still a little different.
And our fans loved it – that song was really popular; it got more than three hundred and fifty thousand YouTube views on the Official Video.
RM: Another great song. One that helps prove, along with the likes of Spectre and Titans, SiX BY SiX have plenty to offer in both the heavy AOR and edgier, angular prog-rock fields.
Meanwhile, thanks for sitting in again with FabricationsHQ Robert. Always insightful, always a pleasure.
RB: Thank you so much Ross; I so appreciate the time you give my career and SiX BY SiX – to be able to do what I do makes me a happy guy, but when it’s artistically super-rewarding, like it is with Ian and Nigel, that makes it all the better!
Ross Muir
Muirsical Conversation With Robert Berry
August 2024
Article dedicated to the memory of American musician & novelist Greg Kihn, who sadly passed away shortly after this interview was conducted.
"Greg Kihn was a kind, fun, and incredibly talented human being. Be it from the stage, on the radio, or walking down the street, Greg always gave you the real Greg Kihn, hook, line, and sinker.
Those of you lucky enough to see him on his last major tour a few years ago, with us as a duo, I know you had a blast. The funny stories, the great songs, and his love of playing to a live audience shined through.
To play bass in his band for sixteen years and be his co-writer was fun, rewarding and an honor.
Though I’ll miss our time, our travels and our performances together, most of all I’ll miss the quirky, cool, lovable guy you were. Thank you for letting me be a small part of your history. They don’t make 'em like you anymore. Rest in piece my talented friend." - Robert Berry
Gregory Stanley Kihn (10th July 1949 - 13th August 2024)
Photo Credits:
Robert Berry - official website resource image
SiX By SiX - Dave Lepori (top/ landscape image); Pat Johnson (bottom/ portrait image)
RB: That’s the only way to truly move forward; having the band play live, and get to that wider audience.
We also had a few European dates lined up but they had to be cancelled for a whole number of reasons.
It's tough at the moment; I would love to call you up and say "Hey, Ross, can you book us a few hotels and get us a backline?" But right now, circumstances being what they are, coming over is impossible.
It seems right when the plane is about to lift off from the runway, the flight tower grounds the flight!
RM: Indeed. But, to follow your philosophy of positivity, having even more material to play via the forthcoming third album, along with associated ongoing promotion and word of mouth, will all, hopefully, make performing live, or touring, a distinct possibility.
RB: Well, we are focussed on looking to see where we want to go with the third album, because you're right, we’ll also need more material to play if we are going out on the road.
As I mentioned, we have already started exchanging ideas for album three; once we get the meat of a few songs from those ideas, along with some lyrics, and maybe a strong intro or two, that will get us going on the project and really kick it off.
But, it’s exactly like you said about this band, we are a little bit hard to access immediately.
For me, though, that’s a good thing, artistically. And, if we had done a whole bunch of songs that sounded like Save The Night from the first album, a lot of people would have just said "Oh that’s just heavy AOR with a big chorus at the end," or some other negative comment [laughs].
But that’s the point, the chorus did come in at the end, so it was still a little different.
And our fans loved it – that song was really popular; it got more than three hundred and fifty thousand YouTube views on the Official Video.
RM: Another great song. One that helps prove, along with the likes of Spectre and Titans, SiX BY SiX have plenty to offer in both the heavy AOR and edgier, angular prog-rock fields.
Meanwhile, thanks for sitting in again with FabricationsHQ Robert. Always insightful, always a pleasure.
RB: Thank you so much Ross; I so appreciate the time you give my career and SiX BY SiX – to be able to do what I do makes me a happy guy, but when it’s artistically super-rewarding, like it is with Ian and Nigel, that makes it all the better!
Ross Muir
Muirsical Conversation With Robert Berry
August 2024
Article dedicated to the memory of American musician & novelist Greg Kihn, who sadly passed away shortly after this interview was conducted.
"Greg Kihn was a kind, fun, and incredibly talented human being. Be it from the stage, on the radio, or walking down the street, Greg always gave you the real Greg Kihn, hook, line, and sinker.
Those of you lucky enough to see him on his last major tour a few years ago, with us as a duo, I know you had a blast. The funny stories, the great songs, and his love of playing to a live audience shined through.
To play bass in his band for sixteen years and be his co-writer was fun, rewarding and an honor.
Though I’ll miss our time, our travels and our performances together, most of all I’ll miss the quirky, cool, lovable guy you were. Thank you for letting me be a small part of your history. They don’t make 'em like you anymore. Rest in piece my talented friend." - Robert Berry
Gregory Stanley Kihn (10th July 1949 - 13th August 2024)
Photo Credits:
Robert Berry - official website resource image
SiX By SiX - Dave Lepori (top/ landscape image); Pat Johnson (bottom/ portrait image)