Those that Can, Do
Muirsical Conversation with Pat Travers
Pat Travers has, as the title of his seminal second album states, been Makin' Magic on the rock and roll circuit and in the field of rock guitar for more than three and a half decades.
But it's not always been plain sailing for the noted Canadian guitarist.
After a critically acclaimed five year period – from the 1976 debut album to the classic Pat Travers Band performance at the Reading Festival in 1980 – circumstances, not of his own making, dictated that opportunities to move to the next level and platinum selling status would elude him.
But Pat Travers, a highly respected musician and a true guitarist’s guitarist, remains one of the most consistent recording and performing artists in rock and in 2013 released Can Do, one of the best albums of his entire career.
FabricationsHQ spoke with Pat to discuss Can Do and other significant periods of his career including the early days in the UK, the seldom talked about issues that hamstrung his early eighties releases (and the more recent Fidelis album) and the successful and acclaimed Blues Bureau period of the nineties.
But the conversation started with Can Do and just why it is such a strong, musical statement…
Ross Muir: In the introduction to the FabricationsHQ review of Can Do I stated that you have been in a rich vein of form of late – musically, vocally and song writing wise.
Pat Travers: Yeah, that’s true. At the beginning of 2012 a couple of things happened. I got my falsetto or head voice back after about twenty-five years of being absent – I don’t know why or how but it came storming back – so that gave me another level of vocal ability that had been lacking for a while.
Then I recorded the Blues On Fire album, which had all these songs that were originally recorded in the 1920’s; in the process of figuring out and rearranging these older types of songs the normal rules we all stick with when writing were kind of broken.
That made feel a little freer when writing and I just started coming up with some really good songs; I was able to come up with something, finish it, and all in pretty short order.
o I was on a roll for a while there but near the end of the album – with about three songs left to go – it started to get a little tough but prior to that everything just flowed nice and easy!
But it's not always been plain sailing for the noted Canadian guitarist.
After a critically acclaimed five year period – from the 1976 debut album to the classic Pat Travers Band performance at the Reading Festival in 1980 – circumstances, not of his own making, dictated that opportunities to move to the next level and platinum selling status would elude him.
But Pat Travers, a highly respected musician and a true guitarist’s guitarist, remains one of the most consistent recording and performing artists in rock and in 2013 released Can Do, one of the best albums of his entire career.
FabricationsHQ spoke with Pat to discuss Can Do and other significant periods of his career including the early days in the UK, the seldom talked about issues that hamstrung his early eighties releases (and the more recent Fidelis album) and the successful and acclaimed Blues Bureau period of the nineties.
But the conversation started with Can Do and just why it is such a strong, musical statement…
Ross Muir: In the introduction to the FabricationsHQ review of Can Do I stated that you have been in a rich vein of form of late – musically, vocally and song writing wise.
Pat Travers: Yeah, that’s true. At the beginning of 2012 a couple of things happened. I got my falsetto or head voice back after about twenty-five years of being absent – I don’t know why or how but it came storming back – so that gave me another level of vocal ability that had been lacking for a while.
Then I recorded the Blues On Fire album, which had all these songs that were originally recorded in the 1920’s; in the process of figuring out and rearranging these older types of songs the normal rules we all stick with when writing were kind of broken.
That made feel a little freer when writing and I just started coming up with some really good songs; I was able to come up with something, finish it, and all in pretty short order.
o I was on a roll for a while there but near the end of the album – with about three songs left to go – it started to get a little tough but prior to that everything just flowed nice and easy!
RM: The song writing quality on Can Do has been borne out by the positive reviews for the album; I think it’s one of the best albums of your entire career.
PT: I think so too and those reviews have been positive on all fronts; there hasn’t been any negative reviews.
There have even been reviews by people who probably wouldn’t normally review that sort of album – or at least one of mine! [laughs] So yeah, we’re pleased with it.
All we need now is huge commercial success and we’ll be very happy!
RM: Well, with the backing of Frontiers Records it has every chance.
PT: That’s the other thing I’m happy about. When I initially signed the deal with Frontiers the advantages I saw were they had great distribution and they do good promotion on their albums.
And they’ve done that, so that’s working out too.
RM: Let me take you back ten years or so to the musical path that led to Can Do and the current band.
You were working with Eric Frates and Rick Novarro as a power-trio in the early years of the Millennium and released PT=MC2 in 2005.
But shortly thereafter you re-established the Pat Travers Band as a four-piece, reinstating the trademark twin-guitar sound. What triggered the return to a quartet?
PT: It was Kirk McKim, our other guitar player; it was because of him specifically.
We were jamming together a little bit and we played one or two of my songs and Kirk knew them really, really well. Actually it was more than knew them; he had a real feel for them, too.
After hearing that sound again – and that was always the sound I had envisioned, two guitars, live – I said "this sounds so good I don’t want to not do it!" And Kirk’s been on board ever since.
RM: Kirk’s a fantastic fit for the band and – looking at it from a listener's perspective or the audience side of the stage – he also seems to be the perfect foil for you.
PT: That’s true.
RM: And Kirk’s a great player himself; nice style. He also writes a little?
PT: Yeah. We co-wrote one song together on our previous album Fidelis, but with Can Do I had enough tunes. But Kirk’s written some great stuff and I look forward to using another piece of his music in the future.
RM: When previous drummer Sean Shannon left you brought Sandy Gennaro back for his second tour of Pat Travers Band duty. That’s another great fit.
PT: When Sean decided that he just didn’t want to tour anymore – he wanted to spend more time in the studio and with his daughter, plus his other projects – I didn’t mess around; I only called one person and that was Sandy Gennaro.
Sandy played with me in 1981 through to 1983. We recorded a couple of albums, did a bunch of tours and he’s a great drummer – a master.
He’s a great guy too and I had a lot of good luck in the fact that he was available to come and do this.
RM: That leads nicely to bass player Rodney O’Quinn. Just after Sandy came in Rodney told me he was really jazzed to be playing with someone like Sandy; almost in awe. But they hit it off right away.
And Rodney is the first bass player since original Pat Travers Band bassist Mars Cowling to bring the type of drive and inspiration Mars always delivered.
PT: Right; Rodney’s got great persona. He just fattens up the bottom end, knows just the right thing to play and looks good doing it!
He joined right at the beginning of 2008 and fits in great, but he handles a lot more than just being the bass player – he’s active on many fronts in the Pat Travers Band.
RM: Collectively this band is as strong, certainly in terms of tightness and musical camaraderie, as the classic "back in the day" line-up that featured Mars, Pat Thrall and Tommy Aldridge.
PT: Yeah, we’re definitely like a little Platoon here, the four of us.
We’ve been through quite a bit and survived; there’s been some pretty arduous touring but we enjoy each other’s company and that’s a good thing. That really helps; each one of us is genuinely fond of the others.
PT: I think so too and those reviews have been positive on all fronts; there hasn’t been any negative reviews.
There have even been reviews by people who probably wouldn’t normally review that sort of album – or at least one of mine! [laughs] So yeah, we’re pleased with it.
All we need now is huge commercial success and we’ll be very happy!
RM: Well, with the backing of Frontiers Records it has every chance.
PT: That’s the other thing I’m happy about. When I initially signed the deal with Frontiers the advantages I saw were they had great distribution and they do good promotion on their albums.
And they’ve done that, so that’s working out too.
RM: Let me take you back ten years or so to the musical path that led to Can Do and the current band.
You were working with Eric Frates and Rick Novarro as a power-trio in the early years of the Millennium and released PT=MC2 in 2005.
But shortly thereafter you re-established the Pat Travers Band as a four-piece, reinstating the trademark twin-guitar sound. What triggered the return to a quartet?
PT: It was Kirk McKim, our other guitar player; it was because of him specifically.
We were jamming together a little bit and we played one or two of my songs and Kirk knew them really, really well. Actually it was more than knew them; he had a real feel for them, too.
After hearing that sound again – and that was always the sound I had envisioned, two guitars, live – I said "this sounds so good I don’t want to not do it!" And Kirk’s been on board ever since.
RM: Kirk’s a fantastic fit for the band and – looking at it from a listener's perspective or the audience side of the stage – he also seems to be the perfect foil for you.
PT: That’s true.
RM: And Kirk’s a great player himself; nice style. He also writes a little?
PT: Yeah. We co-wrote one song together on our previous album Fidelis, but with Can Do I had enough tunes. But Kirk’s written some great stuff and I look forward to using another piece of his music in the future.
RM: When previous drummer Sean Shannon left you brought Sandy Gennaro back for his second tour of Pat Travers Band duty. That’s another great fit.
PT: When Sean decided that he just didn’t want to tour anymore – he wanted to spend more time in the studio and with his daughter, plus his other projects – I didn’t mess around; I only called one person and that was Sandy Gennaro.
Sandy played with me in 1981 through to 1983. We recorded a couple of albums, did a bunch of tours and he’s a great drummer – a master.
He’s a great guy too and I had a lot of good luck in the fact that he was available to come and do this.
RM: That leads nicely to bass player Rodney O’Quinn. Just after Sandy came in Rodney told me he was really jazzed to be playing with someone like Sandy; almost in awe. But they hit it off right away.
And Rodney is the first bass player since original Pat Travers Band bassist Mars Cowling to bring the type of drive and inspiration Mars always delivered.
PT: Right; Rodney’s got great persona. He just fattens up the bottom end, knows just the right thing to play and looks good doing it!
He joined right at the beginning of 2008 and fits in great, but he handles a lot more than just being the bass player – he’s active on many fronts in the Pat Travers Band.
RM: Collectively this band is as strong, certainly in terms of tightness and musical camaraderie, as the classic "back in the day" line-up that featured Mars, Pat Thrall and Tommy Aldridge.
PT: Yeah, we’re definitely like a little Platoon here, the four of us.
We’ve been through quite a bit and survived; there’s been some pretty arduous touring but we enjoy each other’s company and that’s a good thing. That really helps; each one of us is genuinely fond of the others.
The PT Platoon: Kirk McKim, Pat Travers, Rodney O'Quinn and Sandy Gennaro.
(Drum) Major Gennaro is on his second tour of duty with the Pat Travers Band,
having served during the Radio Active and Black Pearl campaigns, 1981 to 1983.
RM: We mentioned Sean a little earlier. He's still very much part of the Pat Travers Band "family."
And Sean isn’t just a great drummer; he's a great producer and studio engineer.
PT: Sean hooked up with me about 1994 and, other than the time he was in Molly Hatchet and on the road, we’ve pretty much had some sort of a connection, either recording together or playing live with me.
In fact Sean calculated that last year, when we were in the studio together, we recorded and mixed fifty-two songs. One a week!
RM: Wow [laughs]. But that goes back to what we were saying earlier about that rich vein of form.
PT: Yeah, we were pretty busy! [Iaughs]. I’ve spent a lot of time with Sean, too.
He’s so engaging and funny that we always have a good time when we’re working – we laugh a lot and that’s another good thing!
RM: Sean played a major part in the sound of Can Do, which is another great aspect of the album.
Can Do has a real Heat in the Street vibe about it but you also have a very modern sounding album that manages to incorporate that classic Pat Travers Band sonic. The perfect package of songs and sound.
PT: Well that was another interesting thing that happened.
Sean has been making great recordings for years but, around the same time I got my falsetto back and started writing a lot of songs, he found a new tone, or a new way to tune his recording room.
All of a sudden Sean's mixes became something really special but I think it’s kind of hard to put your finger on any one thing; it was just a natural progression and he's found a place that’s almost like a sweet spot.
I’m very lucky; I know that. Everything sounds really good and the production has a lot to do with how the songs are presented, for sure.
RM: Fidelis – which I’d like to talk about a little – is another album with a great sound.
PT: Steve Thompson was the co-producer on Fidelis and he’s really, really good.
He mixed Guns N’ Roses first record, co-produced Cutting Crew’s debut and has been involved with all kinds of people who have these iconic sounding records.
RM: You don't just have a great sound on Fidelis – there are some excellent songs on there, too.
Stay, for example, deserved serious radio airplay but, sadly, circumstances would dictate otherwise...
(Drum) Major Gennaro is on his second tour of duty with the Pat Travers Band,
having served during the Radio Active and Black Pearl campaigns, 1981 to 1983.
RM: We mentioned Sean a little earlier. He's still very much part of the Pat Travers Band "family."
And Sean isn’t just a great drummer; he's a great producer and studio engineer.
PT: Sean hooked up with me about 1994 and, other than the time he was in Molly Hatchet and on the road, we’ve pretty much had some sort of a connection, either recording together or playing live with me.
In fact Sean calculated that last year, when we were in the studio together, we recorded and mixed fifty-two songs. One a week!
RM: Wow [laughs]. But that goes back to what we were saying earlier about that rich vein of form.
PT: Yeah, we were pretty busy! [Iaughs]. I’ve spent a lot of time with Sean, too.
He’s so engaging and funny that we always have a good time when we’re working – we laugh a lot and that’s another good thing!
RM: Sean played a major part in the sound of Can Do, which is another great aspect of the album.
Can Do has a real Heat in the Street vibe about it but you also have a very modern sounding album that manages to incorporate that classic Pat Travers Band sonic. The perfect package of songs and sound.
PT: Well that was another interesting thing that happened.
Sean has been making great recordings for years but, around the same time I got my falsetto back and started writing a lot of songs, he found a new tone, or a new way to tune his recording room.
All of a sudden Sean's mixes became something really special but I think it’s kind of hard to put your finger on any one thing; it was just a natural progression and he's found a place that’s almost like a sweet spot.
I’m very lucky; I know that. Everything sounds really good and the production has a lot to do with how the songs are presented, for sure.
RM: Fidelis – which I’d like to talk about a little – is another album with a great sound.
PT: Steve Thompson was the co-producer on Fidelis and he’s really, really good.
He mixed Guns N’ Roses first record, co-produced Cutting Crew’s debut and has been involved with all kinds of people who have these iconic sounding records.
RM: You don't just have a great sound on Fidelis – there are some excellent songs on there, too.
Stay, for example, deserved serious radio airplay but, sadly, circumstances would dictate otherwise...
PT: When Fidelis started out it was going to be our best album ever and recording circumstances were going to be nothing less than ideal. Unfortunately, once we got in to it, a whole bunch of stuff happened.
We got hit by lightning one night, which blew out the transformers on the SSL consoles, so we were five weeks without a mixing board!
hat made life very difficult; we couldn’t really do anything at that point except rehearse.
RM: That has to be incredibly frustrating; especially if you are in "recording" mode.
PT: It created a lot of stress because by the time we were able to record again we were supposed to be finished! And we had shows to do! We had to go do those shows and then come back.
That really screwed everything up; it just got clunkier and clunkier from there and it was very difficult to get the album finished.
Then, when it was released, it didn’t really have any distribution – the guy had ten thousand CD’s and he was basically selling them out of his garage. It was kind of embarrassing.
RM: Fidelis had no physical distribution at all in the UK and Europe; I was begging for physical CD’s to be sent over so I could run some promotional distribution in the UK but it just never happened.
I think FabricationsHQ was the only site in the UK that ran an official review.
PT: I know. And that sucked. But that was why I was very careful about signing with a label that has good promotion and proper distribution.
RM: Well, here’s the question: would you consider going to Frontiers Records with Fidelis to discuss a
re-issue? It certainly deserves to be heard by a far larger and wider audience.
PT: You know that’s something I believe I’m in my rights to do. I’ve forgotten because it’s been so long since we negotiated the contract but I think I’m supposed to get it back after five years, which is pretty soon.
We’ll see what happens but yeah, why not? It would be really nice to have Fidelis made available, or at least so my hard-core fans could hear it and have a chance to get hold of it. That would be kind of awesome.
RM: It certainly deserves the exposure. Fidelis is a great album that could have been an outstanding one.
However fate and circumstances simply dictated otherwise.
PT: It’s weird. Can Do is a great collection of songs and has a wonderful production, but it’s not like I worked any harder on this album than I did on any other album.
It’s just that every now and then things line up in a certain way, or there’s a certain energy, and it works!
But no matter what anyone says it’s very difficult to predict that happening at any time, you know?
You can have all the ingredients and it’s supposed to be the most amazing thing but it doesn’t measure up. Then there are other times, like now, when all eight cylinders are firing and the machine is really working!
RM: On the subject of initial unpredictability, let me take you right back to the start of your recording career. As you would later write and sing you "came across a lot of water, just to see if it could be," arriving for Life in London in 1975.
It sounds like an urban legend, but the story goes you got off the plane with not much more than a change of clothes, guitar on your back and no record deal.
PT: That’s it exactly! Prior to coming over there was much bravado and "I’m going to do this!" and "I’m going to do that!" but the reality of arriving at Heathrow at eight in the morning – and I believe it was a weekday, too – was "well... what to do now?" [laughter].
What to do now was take a bus to Victoria Station, dump my luggage and guitar and find a place to live in a city I have no clue about! [laughs]. But it was pretty exciting and I was very motivated and very driven.
There was no way I was not getting a record deal; I mean just no way. That was the only result there could be.
We got hit by lightning one night, which blew out the transformers on the SSL consoles, so we were five weeks without a mixing board!
hat made life very difficult; we couldn’t really do anything at that point except rehearse.
RM: That has to be incredibly frustrating; especially if you are in "recording" mode.
PT: It created a lot of stress because by the time we were able to record again we were supposed to be finished! And we had shows to do! We had to go do those shows and then come back.
That really screwed everything up; it just got clunkier and clunkier from there and it was very difficult to get the album finished.
Then, when it was released, it didn’t really have any distribution – the guy had ten thousand CD’s and he was basically selling them out of his garage. It was kind of embarrassing.
RM: Fidelis had no physical distribution at all in the UK and Europe; I was begging for physical CD’s to be sent over so I could run some promotional distribution in the UK but it just never happened.
I think FabricationsHQ was the only site in the UK that ran an official review.
PT: I know. And that sucked. But that was why I was very careful about signing with a label that has good promotion and proper distribution.
RM: Well, here’s the question: would you consider going to Frontiers Records with Fidelis to discuss a
re-issue? It certainly deserves to be heard by a far larger and wider audience.
PT: You know that’s something I believe I’m in my rights to do. I’ve forgotten because it’s been so long since we negotiated the contract but I think I’m supposed to get it back after five years, which is pretty soon.
We’ll see what happens but yeah, why not? It would be really nice to have Fidelis made available, or at least so my hard-core fans could hear it and have a chance to get hold of it. That would be kind of awesome.
RM: It certainly deserves the exposure. Fidelis is a great album that could have been an outstanding one.
However fate and circumstances simply dictated otherwise.
PT: It’s weird. Can Do is a great collection of songs and has a wonderful production, but it’s not like I worked any harder on this album than I did on any other album.
It’s just that every now and then things line up in a certain way, or there’s a certain energy, and it works!
But no matter what anyone says it’s very difficult to predict that happening at any time, you know?
You can have all the ingredients and it’s supposed to be the most amazing thing but it doesn’t measure up. Then there are other times, like now, when all eight cylinders are firing and the machine is really working!
RM: On the subject of initial unpredictability, let me take you right back to the start of your recording career. As you would later write and sing you "came across a lot of water, just to see if it could be," arriving for Life in London in 1975.
It sounds like an urban legend, but the story goes you got off the plane with not much more than a change of clothes, guitar on your back and no record deal.
PT: That’s it exactly! Prior to coming over there was much bravado and "I’m going to do this!" and "I’m going to do that!" but the reality of arriving at Heathrow at eight in the morning – and I believe it was a weekday, too – was "well... what to do now?" [laughter].
What to do now was take a bus to Victoria Station, dump my luggage and guitar and find a place to live in a city I have no clue about! [laughs]. But it was pretty exciting and I was very motivated and very driven.
There was no way I was not getting a record deal; I mean just no way. That was the only result there could be.
RM: Musical history shows that relatively short but prolific period worked out incredibly well, producing what has come to be regarded as the classic trio of Pat Travers solo releases – the eponymous debut album, Makin’ Magic and Putting It Straight.
PT: Right. And what was cool was the record company never expected a hit right out of the box.
The first album sold a little, the second a little more and the third a little more again.
So it continued to increase as regards commercial success and the label allowed me at least a couple of years to progress as an artist – or at least they did with me, but that sort of thing has now gone.
There are no record companies that groom new artists any more; they want them full blown and ready to rock.
RM: Don’t they just. The business model within the music industry, and the mechanics of that model, has changed dramatically over the last ten to fifteen years. And for the worst.
PT: I always tell people that I believe there’s show business and there’s the music business.
All the pop bands, the boy bands, Miley Cyrus, all that sort of stuff – that’s show business; that’s really not what I do.
RM: No. It’s not rock ‘n’ roll, is it?
PT: Exactly. It’s not rock ‘n’ roll, no.
RM: Talking about those early albums recalls a story I have never told you – back in the seventies there were music catalogue companies in the UK that allowed you to order records and cassettes by mail.
One magazine was offering the debut album by an artist called Pat Travers and the advert included the picture from the back of the record sleeve.
On seeing the picture I said to a friend "anyone who’s got the balls to wear a shiny red and white panelled Maple Leaf jump suit like that must have the six-string talent to back it up. We need to check this guy out." [laughter].
PT: What was I thinking? [laughs]. Actually, I have no idea what I was thinking! [laughter].
I must have been fairly passionate about it to get someone to go out and make it, but it was pretty weird.
And I was barefoot as well! Hopping around UK pub stages with no shoes on, boy… [laughter].
RM: I have to ask. Do you still have the jumpsuit?
PT: No, I have no idea where that went! That would be something, though!
RM: Pity; I would imagine [Pat's wife] Monica would be delighted if you still had it…
PT: [laughs] Yeah, delighted to throw it in the bin!
RM: Not even ebay?
PT: Nah. In the bin! [laughter]
RM: After that trio of albums punk reared its safety-pinned head in the UK and you headed "back across the water" to put together the Pat Travers Band line-up we touched on earlier.
Mars Cowling had been with you since the get-go but can you recall how Tommy Aldridge and Pat Thrall became part of the band?
PT: Well, Mars and I had been together since late 1975 and we had gone through a number of drummers by the end of 1977; we still didn’t seem to have the guy that was "the guy."
Also, right then we were at the height of punk in the UK so it was very difficult to get any type of serious promotion on what we were doing. But, conversely, in the US we were getting all this positive response; we were selling albums and there was a demand for the band.
So I just thought "I’ve had enough of the UK for now; I want to go somewhere where they want us and it’s not so much of a struggle" and we moved to the US on the first of January 1978.
But we still needed to solve our drummer problem and my manager at the time, David Hemmings, said "what about this guy Tommy Aldridge from Black Oak Arkansas?"
And I went "Yes, absolutely!" because I had seen Tommy on television in 1974 doing his drum solo and he was totally amazing.
So Hemmings got in touch with Tommy; he was in San Francisco at the time but he came out to New York where we were staying and the first time I ever met him was when he was checking in to his room!
And basically he was in the band before we even had one play together!
Anyway, we went to the S.I.R. studios to start rehearsals and he was terrible!
I’m looking at Mars and I’m going "Oh my God, what have we done? He’s terrible, he stinks!"
Then a friend of ours, Allan Shwartzberg, at the time the biggest session drummer in New York City – he would do three or four sessions a day, just taking cabs all over town – he shows up just to say hello!
Now I’m really embarrassed and I decide to take a break but Allan comes over, points to Tommy and says "This is your drummer! This guy is your drummer!" while I'm thinking "man, I don’t know what you’re talking about!" [laughter].
But we had our first show at a small music club called My Father’s Place in Roslyn, Long Island, and when we started to play it was like a different guy!
Tommy just all of a sudden became this incredible live rock drummer and everything was wonderful.
It was just so strange; he got very nervous in rehearsal situations but once he was comfortable and familiar with stuff he was great!
RM: Almost like his natural environment is the live stage.
PT: That’s exactly what it was. Then, as far as Pat Thrall, I believe it was Neal Schon who suggested him.
At any rate Pat was in New York when we were there and we started hanging out; he came to a few shows and we would jam during sound checks or backstage.
We got know each other and he hung out with us for about a month before he joined the band, which was a really nice organic way for him to come in.
RM: And you can’t argue with a quartet that produced Heat in the Street, the critically acclaimed live album Go For What You Know and Crash and Burn. But here’s the thing...
Unlike most others I believe that band was always destined to have a short life span.
There was a clear musical chemistry, but the extreme individual talents and perhaps even the egos meant it was a band destined to produce just two or three albums; albeit of extremely high quality.
PT: Yeah, you’re probably right. Although, if things had been managed better and a lot of things had been different we could have and should have gone to the next level – our next album should have been the one that gave us worldwide success, but that wasn’t to be.
And there was a lot of dissension for just stupid reasons but there’s no problem there now; everyone loves each other. And I’m happy with where I am right now.
RM: That next album you hoped for with Tommy and Pat turned out to be Radio Active featuring Mars and Sandy Gennaro.
While it wasn’t an album that took you to that next level of success – not helped by a lack of promotion – it is a great little album. It carries a vibe, or sonic groove, like no other Pat Travers record.
PT: Unfortunately though, because there were some personal things going on during the recording of that album, it was not an enjoyable experience for me.
That’s also when we started to have problems with management and there were some business things too.
And I was not in the greatest relationship so a lot of personal issues coloured what was going on then.
But Monica has pointed out some songs on that album that she thinks are great.
RM: I totally understand but, I have to tell you, Monica is absolutely right.
The spacey blues of Play It Like You See It and the fusion blues of I Just Wanna Live It My Way are, for me, two of your best ever songs; there’s just so much space on those songs for you to be expressive and allow your notes to breathe.
PT: Well I’ve sort of slowly come around [laughs], but it’s hard for me to listen to that music without feeling the doom and gloom I was connected to at the time.
For me it was just a tough time to feel positive and create an album; I was just feeling all this negative stuff on other fronts.
RM: Oh there is nothing worse than when negativity, or negative energy, is allowed to overrule positivity.
PT: And that’s what I remember very well.
RM: But, to accentuate the positive, it’s a testament to your ability Radio Active is such a good album.
To this day the PT fan-base and a number of critics cite Radioactive and the following album, Black Pearl, as two of your strongest works.
PT: I know! And that’s amazing because we’ve kind of ignored it.
Maybe we should revisit one or two of the songs from Radio Active because there’s definitely some great stuff on there. And a cool sound, too. Dennis MacKay was involved in that album.
RM: And Crash and Burn.
PT: Dennis has become a bit of a legend, apparently. Sean Shannon was telling me there’s a record producer who has a blog and he mentions Crash and Burn as being one of his favourite sounding analogue records. And it’s true; that album really does have an interesting sound to it and that’s definitely associated with Dennis MacKay – or [adopts a strong Scottish accent and shouts] DENNIS MACKAY!
RM: [laughs] Yes, in the native tongue please, laddie.
PT: Aye!
RM: I mentioned Black Pearl; that album followed Radioactive and included Don Harriss on keyboards.
Black Pearl perhaps forms the greatest tragedy of your career because it’s a fabulous hard melodic rock record that should have dominated the airwaves and charts but had no promotion whatsoever.
When asked, I describe Black Pearl as "the greatest under-heard album of the eighties."
PT: Well by that point we had some pretty wild legal issues going on in courts with management and the record company. Some people left the record company that had been there originally and of course when new people come in they’re not interested in the old roster; they want to bring in their own bands.
So, yeah, we did get ignored and I don’t know if that was on purpose – it may have been to some extent – but that was that!
RM: For what it’s worth, I could tell you a couple of stories that confirm you weren’t the only one having promotional or release problems with the label at that specific time.
PT: No, I didn’t think we would be; it wouldn’t make sense for them to do something like that with just us.
Or rather to do nothing! [laughs]
RM: That’s it in a nutshell – it was a do nothing scenario, which was so unfortunate for the Black Pearl album and band.
PT: They did nothing and there you go. But I guess in my particular life-cycle it’s taken until now for me to be vindicated or validated.
I think it’s cool too that, although I’ve had lots of experience, I’ve still been able to come up with some songs that have that spark and have that sound.
PT: Right. And what was cool was the record company never expected a hit right out of the box.
The first album sold a little, the second a little more and the third a little more again.
So it continued to increase as regards commercial success and the label allowed me at least a couple of years to progress as an artist – or at least they did with me, but that sort of thing has now gone.
There are no record companies that groom new artists any more; they want them full blown and ready to rock.
RM: Don’t they just. The business model within the music industry, and the mechanics of that model, has changed dramatically over the last ten to fifteen years. And for the worst.
PT: I always tell people that I believe there’s show business and there’s the music business.
All the pop bands, the boy bands, Miley Cyrus, all that sort of stuff – that’s show business; that’s really not what I do.
RM: No. It’s not rock ‘n’ roll, is it?
PT: Exactly. It’s not rock ‘n’ roll, no.
RM: Talking about those early albums recalls a story I have never told you – back in the seventies there were music catalogue companies in the UK that allowed you to order records and cassettes by mail.
One magazine was offering the debut album by an artist called Pat Travers and the advert included the picture from the back of the record sleeve.
On seeing the picture I said to a friend "anyone who’s got the balls to wear a shiny red and white panelled Maple Leaf jump suit like that must have the six-string talent to back it up. We need to check this guy out." [laughter].
PT: What was I thinking? [laughs]. Actually, I have no idea what I was thinking! [laughter].
I must have been fairly passionate about it to get someone to go out and make it, but it was pretty weird.
And I was barefoot as well! Hopping around UK pub stages with no shoes on, boy… [laughter].
RM: I have to ask. Do you still have the jumpsuit?
PT: No, I have no idea where that went! That would be something, though!
RM: Pity; I would imagine [Pat's wife] Monica would be delighted if you still had it…
PT: [laughs] Yeah, delighted to throw it in the bin!
RM: Not even ebay?
PT: Nah. In the bin! [laughter]
RM: After that trio of albums punk reared its safety-pinned head in the UK and you headed "back across the water" to put together the Pat Travers Band line-up we touched on earlier.
Mars Cowling had been with you since the get-go but can you recall how Tommy Aldridge and Pat Thrall became part of the band?
PT: Well, Mars and I had been together since late 1975 and we had gone through a number of drummers by the end of 1977; we still didn’t seem to have the guy that was "the guy."
Also, right then we were at the height of punk in the UK so it was very difficult to get any type of serious promotion on what we were doing. But, conversely, in the US we were getting all this positive response; we were selling albums and there was a demand for the band.
So I just thought "I’ve had enough of the UK for now; I want to go somewhere where they want us and it’s not so much of a struggle" and we moved to the US on the first of January 1978.
But we still needed to solve our drummer problem and my manager at the time, David Hemmings, said "what about this guy Tommy Aldridge from Black Oak Arkansas?"
And I went "Yes, absolutely!" because I had seen Tommy on television in 1974 doing his drum solo and he was totally amazing.
So Hemmings got in touch with Tommy; he was in San Francisco at the time but he came out to New York where we were staying and the first time I ever met him was when he was checking in to his room!
And basically he was in the band before we even had one play together!
Anyway, we went to the S.I.R. studios to start rehearsals and he was terrible!
I’m looking at Mars and I’m going "Oh my God, what have we done? He’s terrible, he stinks!"
Then a friend of ours, Allan Shwartzberg, at the time the biggest session drummer in New York City – he would do three or four sessions a day, just taking cabs all over town – he shows up just to say hello!
Now I’m really embarrassed and I decide to take a break but Allan comes over, points to Tommy and says "This is your drummer! This guy is your drummer!" while I'm thinking "man, I don’t know what you’re talking about!" [laughter].
But we had our first show at a small music club called My Father’s Place in Roslyn, Long Island, and when we started to play it was like a different guy!
Tommy just all of a sudden became this incredible live rock drummer and everything was wonderful.
It was just so strange; he got very nervous in rehearsal situations but once he was comfortable and familiar with stuff he was great!
RM: Almost like his natural environment is the live stage.
PT: That’s exactly what it was. Then, as far as Pat Thrall, I believe it was Neal Schon who suggested him.
At any rate Pat was in New York when we were there and we started hanging out; he came to a few shows and we would jam during sound checks or backstage.
We got know each other and he hung out with us for about a month before he joined the band, which was a really nice organic way for him to come in.
RM: And you can’t argue with a quartet that produced Heat in the Street, the critically acclaimed live album Go For What You Know and Crash and Burn. But here’s the thing...
Unlike most others I believe that band was always destined to have a short life span.
There was a clear musical chemistry, but the extreme individual talents and perhaps even the egos meant it was a band destined to produce just two or three albums; albeit of extremely high quality.
PT: Yeah, you’re probably right. Although, if things had been managed better and a lot of things had been different we could have and should have gone to the next level – our next album should have been the one that gave us worldwide success, but that wasn’t to be.
And there was a lot of dissension for just stupid reasons but there’s no problem there now; everyone loves each other. And I’m happy with where I am right now.
RM: That next album you hoped for with Tommy and Pat turned out to be Radio Active featuring Mars and Sandy Gennaro.
While it wasn’t an album that took you to that next level of success – not helped by a lack of promotion – it is a great little album. It carries a vibe, or sonic groove, like no other Pat Travers record.
PT: Unfortunately though, because there were some personal things going on during the recording of that album, it was not an enjoyable experience for me.
That’s also when we started to have problems with management and there were some business things too.
And I was not in the greatest relationship so a lot of personal issues coloured what was going on then.
But Monica has pointed out some songs on that album that she thinks are great.
RM: I totally understand but, I have to tell you, Monica is absolutely right.
The spacey blues of Play It Like You See It and the fusion blues of I Just Wanna Live It My Way are, for me, two of your best ever songs; there’s just so much space on those songs for you to be expressive and allow your notes to breathe.
PT: Well I’ve sort of slowly come around [laughs], but it’s hard for me to listen to that music without feeling the doom and gloom I was connected to at the time.
For me it was just a tough time to feel positive and create an album; I was just feeling all this negative stuff on other fronts.
RM: Oh there is nothing worse than when negativity, or negative energy, is allowed to overrule positivity.
PT: And that’s what I remember very well.
RM: But, to accentuate the positive, it’s a testament to your ability Radio Active is such a good album.
To this day the PT fan-base and a number of critics cite Radioactive and the following album, Black Pearl, as two of your strongest works.
PT: I know! And that’s amazing because we’ve kind of ignored it.
Maybe we should revisit one or two of the songs from Radio Active because there’s definitely some great stuff on there. And a cool sound, too. Dennis MacKay was involved in that album.
RM: And Crash and Burn.
PT: Dennis has become a bit of a legend, apparently. Sean Shannon was telling me there’s a record producer who has a blog and he mentions Crash and Burn as being one of his favourite sounding analogue records. And it’s true; that album really does have an interesting sound to it and that’s definitely associated with Dennis MacKay – or [adopts a strong Scottish accent and shouts] DENNIS MACKAY!
RM: [laughs] Yes, in the native tongue please, laddie.
PT: Aye!
RM: I mentioned Black Pearl; that album followed Radioactive and included Don Harriss on keyboards.
Black Pearl perhaps forms the greatest tragedy of your career because it’s a fabulous hard melodic rock record that should have dominated the airwaves and charts but had no promotion whatsoever.
When asked, I describe Black Pearl as "the greatest under-heard album of the eighties."
PT: Well by that point we had some pretty wild legal issues going on in courts with management and the record company. Some people left the record company that had been there originally and of course when new people come in they’re not interested in the old roster; they want to bring in their own bands.
So, yeah, we did get ignored and I don’t know if that was on purpose – it may have been to some extent – but that was that!
RM: For what it’s worth, I could tell you a couple of stories that confirm you weren’t the only one having promotional or release problems with the label at that specific time.
PT: No, I didn’t think we would be; it wouldn’t make sense for them to do something like that with just us.
Or rather to do nothing! [laughs]
RM: That’s it in a nutshell – it was a do nothing scenario, which was so unfortunate for the Black Pearl album and band.
PT: They did nothing and there you go. But I guess in my particular life-cycle it’s taken until now for me to be vindicated or validated.
I think it’s cool too that, although I’ve had lots of experience, I’ve still been able to come up with some songs that have that spark and have that sound.
if Can Do had come out in 1980 it would have been triple platinum by now.
RM: That’s a valid point but something very much in its favour in the current climate is the resurgence in classic rock.
You’re catching a wave and have picked a good time to be with a label that champion classic and melodic rock.
PT: The other interesting thing is it’s currently on the Amazon Rock Chart but the only band I’m familiar with that’s on that chart is Nickelback!
I’m out there with newer, younger rock bands, which is very weird!
RM: I don’t think being in amongst the newer bands is that weird because making an impression on such a chart goes back to what we have been talking about – great songs, great sound, and great reviews for one of the best albums of your career. And the right label behind it.
PT: We got to number five on that chart but it’s hard to tell where you are going to be at any given time because the Amazon charts are updated hourly, but we’ve been in and out of the top five.
Actually Can Do has been on that chart since its release; I hope that means something!
RM: Oh it does; the Amazon charts do tell a story; Can Do is making a statement.
We spoke about the the early eighties; by the early nineties you had signed to the Blues Bureau label.
I remember a "can’t go on flogging a dead horse" remark you made about a year after the aptly titled School of Hard Knocks album had been released in 1990 – was the changing musical climate a defining factor in your decision to recharge your blues batteries?
PT: Well it was a practical matter, too. Mike Varney, who had great success in the eighties with Shrapnel Records and the shredder guitarists, is a big blues aficionado and he wanted to start this blues label.
So it was his idea; he offered me a nice little chunk of money but what was really enticing was I didn’t have to write any songs! Writing songs is probably the hardest part of the whole process.
I just had to go in and rearrange a whole bunch of existing songs, although I did end up writing one original song for Blues Tracks, that first Blues Bureau album.
RM: Good album but then they all were. You went on to record a sequel to Blues Tracks and one other covers album, but you also released four blues-based or blues-rock albums of predominately original material for the Blues Bureau label. Pretty prolific period.
PT: Yeah, but it did start out as a practical matter because I knew creating and recording my own music was going to take some time.
That’s another reason why Can Do is really good; I spread the recording out over a period of eight months.
We would go out on tour and then I would come back and go in to the studio for two or three days in a row before going back out on tour again; I had a lot of time to sit and just let stuff settle.
When I decided to keep a particular track, or take, or overdub, I had the time to be very convinced it was the right one – I didn’t end up second guessing myself too much on this album.
RM: That brings us nicely back to the present and the perfect time for another Can Do track, which I’d like you to pick.
PT: Well we recently had a rehearsal for the first time in a long time because we want to play more of the new songs live; we rehearsed Long Time Gone and Stand Up. I think we should go with Long Time Gone!
RM: The Long Time Gone freight train thundering down the PT tracks it is...
PT: That rehearsal I mentioned was for the Wounded Warriors show in St. Louis; the night before the show the promoter invited us over to his home for some St. Louis Barbeque, which was awesome!
Anyway it turns out he has quite the guitar collection; nothing really vintage but he has this copy of a 1957 Les Paul Goldtop with the PAF humbuckers on it.
To me that was the best Les Paul ever made and this looks exactly like one from 1957.
He said he would rent it to me for a dollar a year and I got to take it home with me!
RM: Nice; but please tell me you’re going to plug it in and play and not just stare at it sitting in your living room [laughs].
PT: I played it at that show. I just needed to change the strings because it had light gauge strings on it but boy, it looks awesome and it sounds evil!
This will be a recording guitar for sure; it’s not going anywhere but the studio!
RM: So we won’t see the guitar over here in the UK but we will see you and the band when you bring the Can Do tour over to Europe – including a scheduled at the eleventh hour gig at the Classic Grand in Glasgow.
PT: I know! When I saw that I was so happy because I knew the wrath I would have to face from my Scottish fans! [laughter].
I was shamefaced when I found out we didn’t even have an Edinburgh gig this time but that’s great.
And we’ve got some fans and a couple of friends over in Edinburgh so I’m sure they will be able to come by.
RM: The venue couldn’t be more centrally located; fans coming in from out-of-town will have no problems.
Pat, thanks for taking the time to make this an extended chat; the only thing that remains for me to add is what I say each and every time we hook up – thank you for Dedication.
PT: Well thank you brother, and thanks for all you do for us, I sure appreciate it.
One of these days I’m probably going to re-record Dedication. I have this idea to do a super-produced acoustic album; in other words an acoustic album but not bare bones – lots of acoustic guitars.
Dedication is one the songs that I definitely want to do.
RM: Oh we have to continue that album discussion over a couple of Single Malts…
PT: But nothing too peaty! My take on the last one somebody got me was they got it mixed up with a brass cleaner! It was more than peaty, it was a solvent! [laughter[.
RM: I'm a Balvenie man; I don’t do peaty – that’s snortin’ whisky! Sorry, couldn't resist [laughs].
Macallan for you?
PT: Yeah, Macallan for me; that’s good whisky! Cheers!
Anyway it turns out he has quite the guitar collection; nothing really vintage but he has this copy of a 1957 Les Paul Goldtop with the PAF humbuckers on it.
To me that was the best Les Paul ever made and this looks exactly like one from 1957.
He said he would rent it to me for a dollar a year and I got to take it home with me!
RM: Nice; but please tell me you’re going to plug it in and play and not just stare at it sitting in your living room [laughs].
PT: I played it at that show. I just needed to change the strings because it had light gauge strings on it but boy, it looks awesome and it sounds evil!
This will be a recording guitar for sure; it’s not going anywhere but the studio!
RM: So we won’t see the guitar over here in the UK but we will see you and the band when you bring the Can Do tour over to Europe – including a scheduled at the eleventh hour gig at the Classic Grand in Glasgow.
PT: I know! When I saw that I was so happy because I knew the wrath I would have to face from my Scottish fans! [laughter].
I was shamefaced when I found out we didn’t even have an Edinburgh gig this time but that’s great.
And we’ve got some fans and a couple of friends over in Edinburgh so I’m sure they will be able to come by.
RM: The venue couldn’t be more centrally located; fans coming in from out-of-town will have no problems.
Pat, thanks for taking the time to make this an extended chat; the only thing that remains for me to add is what I say each and every time we hook up – thank you for Dedication.
PT: Well thank you brother, and thanks for all you do for us, I sure appreciate it.
One of these days I’m probably going to re-record Dedication. I have this idea to do a super-produced acoustic album; in other words an acoustic album but not bare bones – lots of acoustic guitars.
Dedication is one the songs that I definitely want to do.
RM: Oh we have to continue that album discussion over a couple of Single Malts…
PT: But nothing too peaty! My take on the last one somebody got me was they got it mixed up with a brass cleaner! It was more than peaty, it was a solvent! [laughter[.
RM: I'm a Balvenie man; I don’t do peaty – that’s snortin’ whisky! Sorry, couldn't resist [laughs].
Macallan for you?
PT: Yeah, Macallan for me; that’s good whisky! Cheers!
Ross Muir
Muirsical Conversation with Pat Travers
September 2013
Pat Travers website: http://www.pattravers.com/
Pat Travers on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pattraversband?fref=ts
The song Dedication, mentioned towards the end of the above article, is Ross Muir's all-time favourite piece of music. Audio of the song can be found within the writer's 'Muirsical Six Of The Best' article.
Photo credits: Michael van Gelder (Pat Travers); Wilma Hoogendoorn (Pat Travers Band).
Audio tracks presented to accompany the above article and to promote the work of the artist.
No infringement of copyright is intended.
Muirsical Conversation with Pat Travers
September 2013
Pat Travers website: http://www.pattravers.com/
Pat Travers on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pattraversband?fref=ts
The song Dedication, mentioned towards the end of the above article, is Ross Muir's all-time favourite piece of music. Audio of the song can be found within the writer's 'Muirsical Six Of The Best' article.
Photo credits: Michael van Gelder (Pat Travers); Wilma Hoogendoorn (Pat Travers Band).
Audio tracks presented to accompany the above article and to promote the work of the artist.
No infringement of copyright is intended.