FabricationsHQ - Putting the Words to the Music
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  • FabricationsHQ Q&As With...
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    • Michael Jackson: The Alternative Verdict (Nov 2011)
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    • It's a New Language, Old Bean (October 2010)
    • Finger Pointing (July 2010)
    • Suffer the Little Children (April 2010)
    • Hey 'Banker', can you spare a dime? (February 2010)
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Wherever I Lay My Palm Leaf Hat...
Muirsical Conversation With Paul Young 
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To this day Paul Young is described more times than not by music critics and the media with the same three words preceding his name – "eighties pop artist…"

Given the British singer’s huge success throughout that decade it’s perhaps understandable (and Young still performs the hits that made him famous on solo shows) but it does a serious disservice to his later career – Paul Young is a more versatile and well-rounded artist now than the Paul Young who had hit after hit in the 80’s.

By way of examples the Nashville inspired Paul Young (1997) is the singer’s most accomplished and mature album while Rock Swings (2006) is his most creative and interesting.

Young has also made a name for himself in the art of cooking, having featured in the popular TV programmes Celebrity MasterChef and Hell’s Kitchen, and has produced a cookbook of his favourite recipes.

More lately however Paul Young has swapped the white toque for the Mexican Palm Leaf hat of Los Pacaminos, the talented septet who perform Tex-Mex and Border music.

Los Pacaminos are a far Mexican cry from the critically acclaimed No Parlez album and musically have little in common with a song such as 'Come Back And Stay' or Young’s hugely successful covers of Marvin Gaye’s 'Wherever I Lay My Hat' and 'Everytime You Go Away' by Daryl Hall & John Oates, but Los Pacaminos are simply another string to Paul Young’s bow. 
Actually, make that another string on Paul Young’s Los Pacaminos instrument of choice, the bajo sexto.

In June 2014 Los Pacaminos released their second album A Fistful of Statins and while both band and album became focal points of Paul Young's chat with FabricationsHQ, we started by establishing just how the singer found himself on the Texas-Mexico border...

Ross Muir: So how does a Bedfordshire boy, known for his R&B and blue-eyed soul pop, get the Tex-Mex bug?  

Paul Young: Ry Cooder is the conduit; he got me on to the Tex-Mex thing. One of the greatest things Ry does, as a musician, is to go off and study with other musicians in different parts of the world; that gives him an understanding and appreciation of how those other genres of music are made.
And that was part of the reason behind Los Pacaminos because around the time I was getting in to Ry Cooder he was using R&B backing singers, playing a bajo sexto [Mexican stringed instrument] and using musicians from various countries including Flaco Jiménez on the accordion. It was a curious mix but it worked, and that influenced me in travelling from the R&B soul-based stuff to the Tex-Mex stuff.
So, yeah, I knew what R&B and soul was – and I could hear that in Ry Cooder’s music 
– but what’s the Mexican stuff I can hear? I explored that side of the music and just got deeper and deeper into it.
I was already familiar with Los Lobos, then I found out Flaco Jiménez was also in the Texas Tornados.
From there I started discovering other styles of Mexican music 
– the Cojunto music of the north and Mexican America and Mariachi, originally from the middle of Mexico. Mariachi is a very joyous music but it's also very difficult to play. Carrying on down south it gets more Cumbia based… and I’m still going!
I’m listening to stuff from South America now; I just love the whole thing.

RM: That certainly comes across on A Fistful of Statins. The Los Pacaminos debut was a fun little release but Fistful is a great album, mixing so many Border Music genres – there’s Texas cajun, Texas country, a little bit of Mariachi and polka… you’ve even managed to drop in a doo wop meets country love song.
It sounds like you had a cracking time recording Fistful.

PY: We really did. You say you’ve heard the first one?

RM: I have a copy in the old Muirsical collection and – this is absolutely true – in a spooky example of musical serendipity I had been playing the debut the day before Cherry Red Records sent through the press release for the Fistful album.

PY: That’s great. We were really pleased with the first album and I remember some of the guys saying "that’s turned out so much better than even we thought it would!"
It caught the humour of the band and the fun side of the music but some of the lyrics have a little bit of poignancy. When it came to recording this album we were all thinking "are we going to be able to capture that again?" but I think we surpassed it. We’re really starting to find our own sound now.


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RM: I would agree with that and this time around you have stronger songs and stronger production; even the musicianship seems to be up a notch.
As I said earlier it’s a great album; I only hope it gets the recognition and airplay it deserves.

PY: So do I! In the beginning of Los Pacaminos we just wanted to keep it small and be able to enjoy it, playing the bars and clubs. Some of the boys were still a bit like that with this one, wanting to keep it small, but towards the end of recording this album I pleaded with them, saying "we can’t do that with this one, it’s too good. It has to reach a wider audience."
I’m not going to work so hard on something just to sell it off a merchandise table at gigs, that would be a waste. So this time we've decided to really go for it.

RM: That’s a great way to sum up what you have here; this is not a CD-sold-at-gigs album, not by a long away.

PY: No, I agree.

RM: A Fistful of Statins is musically quite diverse and actually goes beyond Tex-Mex. You have a mash-up mix of polka and country on the Girl From Tennessee; some dusty blues in the form of Every Little Hero; Then there’s the ballad A Letter To You featuring some great pedal steel from Melvin Duffy and a lovely lead vocal from you.

PY: Thank you and that’s exactly what I’ve started to say to people – we play Border Music now, not Tex-Mex. It’s "Stories from the South," really…

RM: From the Tejano country boy to where it all started for you – prior to the hits and the eighties success you were putting your voice to some soul and blues numbers mid-set in your days with the Kat Kool & The Kool Kats…

PY: Yes. The Kool Kats were a rock band and that didn’t really suit my style of vocals. Free were my favourite band and because they were blues based I started to listen to, and buy, a lot of Freddie King and Albert King. So I was getting in to those sorts of bands and that was reflected in the stuff I sang mid-set with Kat Kool & The Kool Kats.
I eventually left them to join a band from Harrow called Streetband and, although they started off more as a funky kind of band, they got rockier as time went on – so they ended up being a rock band as well! Although with Toast you would never know! (laughs)

RM: You beat me to the punch because we can’t not mention that song. Toast became a quirky but successful hit for Streetband and it got you on Top of The Pops but looking back now, after all this time, do you regret Toast? In the sense that it probably pigeon-holed Streetband as a gimmick act?

PY: Yeah, because our influences came from the likes of Robert Palmer, Little Feat, The Who, Earth Wind and Fire and Ian Dury – all rolled up in one package!
But we had to cheapen ourselves, we had to almost dumb ourselves down. We were in the middle of punk at the time and our guitarist was a really special player; but you weren’t allowed to be that technically proficient (laughs). So we had to toughen our music up.

RM: The remnants of Streetband became the Q-Tips who didn’t get the wider recognition they deserved. The Q-Tips had some great support band slots on major tours and made a number of notable TV appearances but the two albums were not successful in terms of commercial sales.

PY: No, they weren’t. I don’t know if we were just too authentic or just never mastered the art of recording. I still think the best thing we did was the first thing we did, the single SYSLJFM.

RM: The Joe Tex cover; great little version. It helped showcase, along with tracks like Get ‘Em Up Joe and the cover of Elvis Costello’s High Fidelity, The Q-Tips R&B-based "Blues Brothers" groove.

PY: And even then we were finding some quite inventive ways to cover other peoples songs – our version of High Fidelity was still up-tempo but the different arrangement suited our sound perfectly.
I used to enjoy arranging, I think it gets over-looked sometimes. When you think of the songs of the forties and fifties, everybody used to cover the same songs; but what made Frank Sinatra’s better than everyone else’s was Nelson Riddle’s arrangements. They totally suited Frank's voice.
It’s one thing for Cole Porter or Ira and George Gershwin to write a great song but sometimes it takes a great arranger to lift a particular version above every other version.

RM: Absolutely; but then you’re looking for all the ingredients – great song, great arrangement, great production, great vocal to carry the lyric… the whole package.
Just talking about The Q-Tips has made me realise that perhaps it was a classic case of great band, wrong time? 

PY: I think you’re right. We were an authentic R&B blues band born in the middle of two changing, or crossover, styles.                

RM: Exactly. The Q-Tips emerged just as post-punk new wave was establishing itself, which begat the new romantic movement. The Q-Tips were a band out of time. What The Q-Tips did do however was set you up for a big-label solo career that became quite the phenomenon.
As you were putting together The Royal Family backing band and recording your debut album No Parlez did you know – or could you feel 
– that the album was going to become such a massive success?

PY: I suppose I felt the same way about No Parlez as I feel about A Fistful of Statins. I don’t really know how things are going to end up being received, but with No Parlez – as with Fistful 
– everything just seemed to fall in to place.
With No Parlez every decision I made about the album and the band seemed to be the right ones, like finding [fretless bass player] Pino Palladino, finding The Fabulous Wealthy Tarts [backing singers Maz Roberts and Kim Leslie] and then off-setting that with the craziness of guitarist Steve Bolton’s playing.
And over the top of all that madness an R&B based voice! (laughs)
But it worked, and by the end of the album’s recording I did think "I’ve got something here." 
But then I thought the Q-Tips were good (laughs) and, like you said, it just didn’t happen, so the same thing could have happened with No Parlez. But I had a lot of ground support and at radio because of The Q-Tips;
it was just a matter of waiting for the public to catch up with what I was doing, I think.

RM: No Parlez went on to become your most successful album but I believe the follow up, The Secret of Association, to be far stronger. I think you stepped it up a level on that album, more emphasis on songs than sound; it also carries a darker edge. 

PY: The Secret of Association is a bit more of a moody album 
– which is weird, because when you consider the success I had with No Parlez you might have thought I’d have played it safe or gone a bit shallower. But I think I actually went deeper.

RM: You absolutely did and it's interesting that Everything Must Change, with countrified pedal steel guitar from B.J. Cole, hinted at the musical road you would take a few years later...

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RM: In the nineties you slid away from the musical formula the label probably wanted you to continually repeat and you produced some of your strongest or mature material. For example the Paul Young album from 1997 contains some lovely Nashville arrangements; there’s a real country influence throughout that record. That album is almost like you saying "that was then, this is now." 

PY: It’s funny you should say that because that’s exactly what it was – that was then, this is now.
I was famously quoted around that time as saying "every artist wants to change, every record company wants them to stay the same;" what I was doing with that album was saying "this is where I am now." 
And Los Pacaminos had not long been born so that in turn was influencing the Paul Young solo material.
In fact the song In a Dream Gone By 
– it was touch and go if that would end up on the Paul Young album or become a Pacaminos song.
So we were drifting in and out of Paul Young solo and Los Pacaminos but now there is a very definite difference between what I do as Paul Young and what we do as Los Pacaminos,

RM: Indeed. You can be the solo performer singing the hits in the big show environment and by contrast there’s the musician who is just one part of a large band ensemble playing low-key intimate club gigs.   

PY: People constantly used to say to me "which do you prefer – playing to a massive audience or performing in a little club?" I love ‘em both! The very fact that I can play a little bar means I enjoy the big gigs so much more, and vice versa. And in a club I don’t have to be so formal; I can be a bit stupid (laughs) or say politically incorrect things and get away with it – if you do that on a big stage you will never get away with it.

RM: Well on the big shows you know what the audience have come to hear and see – the hits and their pop-star perception of Paul Young; you have a part to play.
But with Los Pacaminos you have a totally different beast. Intimate surrounding, rootsy music and something you are clearly having a lot of fun with. But then it sounds like you are still having fun with both sides of Paul Young.

PY: I really am. I will get back on to another Paul Young album – it was actually started last year – but I put that on the back-burner because we wanted to get the Fistful album done.
Normally I would put Paul Young first and foremost but having done it this way – with the Pacaminos album coming out on top – I’m actually quite pleased I did; I want to put more attention on Los Pacaminos.
It’s time people understood that I can flip between the two and do them both very well.
I’m constantly amazed when people hear about Los Pacaminos and say to me "but why aren’t you doing the Paul Young stuff any more?" Well, I am (laughs). Why do you think I can only do one thing at any one time? If I can get out of my car and ride a motorbike, why can’t I also do a Paul Young album then move on to a Los Pacaminos album? From car to motorcycle. From solo to band. It’s as simple as that.
And that’s the best analogy I can give you (laughs).          

RM: You’ve even managed to have the car and the bike out on tour at the same time – was it not the 2002 Paul Young UK tour when you had the Pacaminos boys as the support? The only other act I know that did a similar thing was Utopia, Todd Rundgren’s band, back in the day.

PY: I did, yes! It was a great way to run the two side by side but people still seem to think because I’m in the Pacaminos I can’t possibly be doing Paul Young any more. What a load of rubbish.
Still, nice to know I have something in common with Todd Rundgren!


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RM: I knew there was a reason I liked you (laughs). Another Paul Young album I want to chat about is Rock Swings from 2006, where a selection of pop and rock classics get the big band treatment. 

PY: Unfortunately I don’t think it was wholly successful album; the ones I’m proudest of are probably the ones you like the most – Enter Sandman for example. And doing a song like Lose Yourself was a lot of fun.

RM: I think covering Lose Yourself by Eminem was an inspired choice. For me rap is a form of rhythmic expression, not a musical genre, but you put an excellent and interesting spin on what is unarguably one of the more significant and powerful rap songs.    

PY: The one thing I remember about Lose Yourself was it has so many words in it that I had to go in to the lyrics and trim what I thought were the less important passages so I could sing them in our arrangement.
By the time I came to the third verse, which is a long verse, I said "there’s just too many words to trim" and I was told that maybe we should get a rapper in to do that third verse.
But I said no, because that would go against the whole point of doing a rap song in this style. We would have given in, having to pull in a rapper to get us out of trouble.
So I thought "I know, I’ll talk it" and for the third verse I did my best [actor & voice over artist] Michael Madsen impression! (chuckles)

RM: But it works; it gave the song a film noir slant and it’s one of the strongest songs on that album.
Albums such as Paul Young, Rock Swings and A Fistful of Statins – showcasing your ability to successfully mix or crossover various musical styles and not be pinned down as just a pop performer 
– help explain why there are fans of country, melodic rock and even hard rock out there that respect your work.
You’re doing something right, my friend.

PY: Well let’s hope so. I do think the critics always got me wrong; they never really understood what I was up to – all they saw at the end was a product; a good piece of pop.
And they always seemed to think the success or the sound was Laurie Latham the producer, or it must have been this or it must have been that. But I’ve done it well enough times now for them to actually start thinking "you know, maybe he has more input than we thought" (laughs).
When we did the Rock Swings project my manager, arranger Steve Sidwell and I started to pick songs out and once we had a few I said
to them "you know what’s happening here? This is a reflection of my
own record collection."
A song like David Bowie’s Jean Jeanie for example; as a teenager I bought albums like Ziggy Stardust. Now, in the present, and with an understanding of rap artists, we’re doing a song like Lose Yourself.
I started to get in to rap by listening to Snoop Dogg and now I have quite a few rap albums in my collection. And Enter Sandman is a reflection of being into hard rock. I used to go and see AC/DC, right from the first time they came over; I never missed them. Every time they came to my neck of the woods I went to see them. People really wouldn’t think that of me, or that Rock Swings is a reflection of my record collection.

RM: No, because most critics never took the time to l
ook under the skin to see what you’re doing vocally, what you’re doing with your arrangements, where you’re influences come from.
Just to finish the Rock Swings discussion 
– were you aware that Paul Anka did the very same sort of thing the year before you, with his own Rock Swings release?

PY: Yes, because it was going to be part of a collection of Rock Swings releases, but with different artists and a different sub-title each time. Paul’s was simply called Rock Swings, mine was called Rock Swings – On the Wild Side of Swing and the next one would have had a different title again.
But it didn’t go any further than the two albums; at least I don’t think it did.

RM: That explains the similarity. I had never picked up on that yet now that you’ve told me it’s really the only explanation (laughs). From big band swing back to the border – what does the rest of the year and beyond have in store for Los Pacaminos and A Fistful of Statins?

PY: Well we did an album launch show at the end of June and while there are more Los Pacaminos shows set up the rest of the year is actually a mix of Pacaminos and Paul Young shows; it’s fairly even-stevens at the moment. 
There are not as many shows as I’d like yet but it has been a very busy year as regards studio work – but being in the studio doesn’t bring the money in (laughs) so we are working on getting a few more dates organised.

Picture
                     Los Pacaminos, the talented Tex-Mex and Border Music band who produce good
                     music, sport Mexican Palm Leaf hats and carry a Fistful of Statins in their pockets.


PY: In an ideal world, and what I really want to happen, is for this Los Pacaminos album to sell really well and put it in the public eye. That way we can afford to work and operate as a full-time band and the other members of the group won’t have to go off and work with other musicians.
Then we would be able to say "right, for this part of the year we tour as Los Pacaminos and for that part of the year I can tour as Paul Young," which also means we won’t have those terrible moments where I find we have a double booking, which is horrible.

RM: Well here’s to the recognition that both band and new album deserve. Cherry Red Records are a great bunch of boys and girls who thrive on promoting and championing artists doing something different or fresh – so what you are doing with Los Pacaminos is a perfect fit.
And here’s to more shows not south of the border but north of our own border.

PY: Funnily enough we’ve been approached about doing a gig up at Dumfries and Galloway College; they want to do something a little different.
The idea is that I would come up early, they open up the kitchen so we can organise a Paul Young inspired menu and then we play a gig in the refectory that night.

RM: I was actually going to ask you if you had considered something like that, what with your celebrity chef status, where you create a Mexican-Border based menu at Los Pacaminos gigs where food is served. That would be a fantastic way to get a flavour of the music and, yes, pun intended (laughs).

PY: Well, another string that I have to my bow at the moment is a production company and we are working on a "food and music" idea for a television series.
Now, if that comes off and I get a chance to do another programme on food, what I’d dearly love to do is travel to Mexico and regionally discover and discuss their music and their food.
It would be interesting to see how both change from the north to the south because as you travel down the country not only does the music change – and quite dramatically – but the food does as well.
For example as you move south they have many different ways of doing guacamole. They have their own traditions, sauces and bases.
It would be great to see what they grow in each area and how they prepare the food. Then we would find a local band to play some music from that region. I think that would be quite interesting.

RM: I think that would be very interesting. Good food and good music, what's not to like? 
The only thing missing is one or Two Margaritas… but that’s something we can fix right now.
Paul, it’s been a pleasure; I raise my cocktail glass to Los Pacaminos and A Fistful of Statins.

PY: Thanks – and Cheers!  
Ross Muir
Muirsical Conversation with Paul Young
July 2014



A Fistful of Statins by Los Pacaminos is available now on Cherry Red Records.

Photo Credits
Paul Young - Emma Gray Photography 
Los Pacaminos - Official Press Image

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